‘Oppenheimer’ - Interview with Costume Designer Ellen Mirojnick

Oppenheimer became an unexpected box office hit, close to making 1 Billion dollars. Christopher Nolan’s three-hour historical epic follows J. Robert Oppenheimer (Cillian Murphy), the man behind the atomic bomb. Nolan and his team, including Costume Designer Ellen Mirojnick, came together to recreate the iconography of Oppenheimer for the screen.

The film spans decades, locations, and perspectives during its lengthy runtime with over 70 actors in speaking roles and 18 being aged over time, taking the audience into the inner workings of Oppenheimer’s mind. Offscreen had the opportunity to talk to Mirojnick about creating the silhouette of the Oppenheimer suit, a last-minute color palette change, and the myth of the man.

Jillian Chilingerian: Good morning. I'm very excited to talk to you. This is my favorite movie of the year. I've seen it five times. I'm going to try to go for six tonight. This work that your entire team does of creating these lived-in characters in this world-building where every time I returned to it, I'm like, Are these my friends I feel like I know them so well. I want to dive into your work with these costumes helping to bring these historical figures to life through their iconography.

Ellen Mirojnick: At first, it was a task. I think it was really exciting and I had not done anything as historical with so many characters in my career. So working with Chris and having this meal in front of me was just thrilling. The iconography of every single character, our principal characters, all the scientists, and all of the supporting characters was quite fulfilling because there was so much research to become immersed in and that's really what the research was. Picture this you walk into an office with six walls, okay filled with images of every single character in every single situation in every single environment that you could think of. It washes over you in a way that allows you to feel everything and I really do emphasize the word feel because that feeling of who they were what they were, yes, some of them would definitely pose pictures and so on and so forth, not just captured pictures was before us. But what the task really was and what Chris’s first notes were I am very, very, very much wanting, reality authenticity, but we're not making a documentary. We're creating a story that has these characters in it and I really would like it to feel real but original at the same time. With that idea of originality came the overall immersion of it all, but that's what I ran with. In determining how to create this world in a way that also will give Chris characters and scenes and fullness that he can change any way he wants without taking anybody out of the film because of a costume. So there was an extra added clarity about that naturalness that had to be achieved no matter what. Chris also was very keen on having our film appeal to a modern audience what that means and why maybe you think they're your friends and you watch it so many different times that it appeals to a modern audience although it most definitely has historical overtones. I broke down each and every decade of trying to understand specifically, what's the essence of each decade. Another point that was very, very clear from Chris was he did not want a stylized movie or precious movie. It was really important to understand the essence of each and every period, what to what to keep what not to keep, and then dive into each character and what that essence was of each character because we're not making a documentary. It needed to be discerned because every actor came in with so much historical information that it was crazy good, but we had to unglue them in a way so that we could actually design and create the character on their bodies and have them feel absolutely complete as they work walked out of a fitting, so it was a huge challenge, but just such an inspirational one on top of creating a direction in which way to go with each actor. It was an electric dream.

Jillian Chilingerian: Oppenheimer has such a specific look, how was it to work with Cillian and Chris to find that?

Ellen Mirojnick: Cillian is just a marvel as we know, but Chris looked at Oppenheimer in every single decade, every single image of Oppenheimer, and found that there was a similarity to images that Chris had sent to Cillian when he first asked him to do the film. He sent him images of David Bowie's 1970s American life, where his silhouette was exaggerated for the first time, his wide shoulder to a full trouser voluminous, almost topped with a fedora in a particular vibe, and lo and behold, it was so spooky that it was so similar to Oppenheimer's silhouette that Cillian went cool and we were like on the road to creating him pretty quickly. Our work together was quite a great collaboration because of Cillian's size the weight he would lose and what he wouldn't lose, we had to create a proportion that was correct and wouldn't be swimming in a way that looked clownish that you felt him inside and out. We created about 20 different suits for him through that to cover the period whether we used all or not they were there because we had so much time to cover. The one that became the iconic one, I think you'll agree is his silhouette might not have changed. It was beautiful from the 20s that did change a bit because he was a young man in the 20s to the 30s and the 30s led to this iconic, mythic image of him as he opened Los Alamos after he took on this task and he stands by the wind window and picks up his pipe and puts on his hat and walks out the door and he is the king of the mesa. He is the sheriff here he is an empowered rockstar and that's what they were the scientists were the rock stars of their time. He led this band of mad scientists on a road to change the world. Subsequently, I think that image is quite iconic and he was an iconoclast because he was the absolute agent of change of our time.

Jillian Chilingerian: The silhouette has really stuck with me so I bought up the pants.

Ellen Mirojnick: Have you worn the suit?

Jillian Chilingerian: I haven't worn the suit. I did try to find a hat because I was going to go to a Barbie party and I was going to show up as Oppenheimer. I found pants that really give the Oppenheimer aesthetic. It works so well on so many different body types. The pants are just so good.

Ellen Mirojnick: I'm really happy that you extracted that for yourself because I think the silhouette does speak to us. There's something of a is 100% historical accuracy to it, but it was adapted to Cillian because of his face, his size, and so on this shoulder is large and it's soft, not hard in any way. The pants are high and full without a question. The shape is drapey so overall that silhouette is easy to see there's nothing hard about it. It's a soft silhouette that moves with the body and I think just as a designer, that's such an important thing to be able to achieve is to make sure when you have a silhouette that works with the body in such a synchronistic way you love what you look at. It doesn't get in the way. The costume is not walking in front of the actor, for a person such as yourself wearing anything like that it becomes truly appealing. We really did try to do with creating the essence of each and every historical character and adapting it for our film is be able to extract something that has a silhouette, feel, and texture. With IMAX, you can see those textures so clearly.

Jillian Chilingerian: All the praise in the world and going on when you talk about IMAX. I'm curious because obviously in this film we have two sequences that have black and white and color. I remember when Mank came out they did a whole behind-the-scenes of the costumes of different textures or colors that they had to use to really pop on black and white. In the situation, was that similar and especially since we're shooting black and white and these color sequences if there's a crossover, how was that for you?

Ellen Mirojnick: Well in black and white, it's actually quite the opposite in our film. I sat on a panel recently with Trish, where she described all of what they had to do for black and white. When it came to me, I said well no, we didn't do any of that. However, the reason why we didn't do any of that is that we had to be prepared all though. Everything was absolutely clearly defined as what was going to be shot in black and white. We also had to be prepared for it to be shot in color. That doesn't mean they're going to change, so the way that we determined what would work and what wouldn't work was really with an iPhone black-and-white filter. It was as simple as that. Then certain actors dressed and and did tests to make sure that we liked the way it looked. It was like an experiment, but nothing really had to be changed by using that filter. We got as close to a definite image as we could get at that time and it always worked out. When we would look at a fabrication for example for Strauss, I remember this very, very specifically about the suit that he wears at the institute. When it comes to the institute that pinstripe there's a twist in it and it has some cashmere in it. We thought at first this looked a little bit too blue and there was another coloration with it which looked at that had a cooler tone to it maybe a bit more brown tone to it, but it was clearly more gray with definition and it didn't work. It went to mud. The one that did work was of course the one that became clear and sharp and the one that had a tone of blue, but when you shot it in color as well as black and white, it didn't read blue. So it's a matter of selection and swatching and seeing what you can actually move in any direction and then cutting and shooting it. I would say we were fairly lucky in the respect of understanding immediately once we did those tests what was going to work and what wasn't going to work. For example, when you see a scene like the Senate, where there is a big population of black and white, you can design what the frame looks like by the contrasts in play in the placement of people in the whole design of the frame, and so on and what you wouldn't want, you could use a navy solid or a gray solid as well. Not black. The same with brown as long as there was a bit of texture in it. Textures were our friend without a question of the doubt but what was really great with black and white as well was being able to use and what Chris loved was being able to use white, not doing anything where it's softened by any stretch that it actually created a hard contrast, which was so good in the total contrast of to the film of what we had in Los Alamos or Berkeley, because that such a different type of palette and elicited such a different type of feel.

Jillian Chilingerian: I actually wanted to ask about the color sequences, specifically the color palettes of where we are in location. Everything just seamlessly matches, but it's so natural and authentic even for everyone in the background. Often with the costume design, we forget you're dressing more than just the three main characters. How was that to coordinate what these color palettes were going to look like across multiple bodies? One moment I think of is when he's doing his speech in the lounge and the seats are rattling, it's like how everyone is like dressed. Nothing is too distracting.

Ellen Mirojnick: Interestingly, you say that particular scene. I am very very, very hard on, on costumes in the body of a population of people, and scenes it's like painting a painting. Jillian, it's I can't explain it other than that. It's like painting a painting. All of these people are going to be the movement of the frame. It's going to be at the forefront of the frame. Do you know what the whole piece is going to look like? It's before you and so moving those people in and out are changing a color here and there is always what I am absolutely 100% attentive to not only when they come on set, but it starts in the fitting. It starts in the fitting and then I'll look at all the images together at the end of the day or or halfway point and see what I need to change and how I have to do work or not do work or let's leave until we get on set. The scene that you spoke of specifically, was not planned to be like that. And I think I love that scene and I love it in particular because that was a last minute. A very, very, very last-minute ask and change the color of the palette in that scene to be fairly bright. And that brought together bright, okay, it's not just one person in an apple green shirt or something that's roaming in the background some other place. You know, the whole scene was bright in comparison to the rest of the film. The day before we shot it. Chris and Emma asked if that scene we would make sure that that scene was dressed in bright colors and I said bright colors. It's not anything we ever talked about. But okay, you want it to be bright. We'll make it bright. And so fortunately, very fortunately because you know there are times the costume Angel sits on your shoulders in this case it did because we had one of my assistants was still in LA doing work to go ahead and we sent her like at 3:30 in the afternoon to Palace costume in LA and whereby I knew how much bright 40s clothing existed in that shop and I said please just go in, get the last row, send me everything in the last row. I just happened to know where all of that was including bringing shirts and jackets. Fortunately, we had a van that went back and forth between LA and New Mexico so we pulled everything and put it in the van that night. It came I think at one o'clock in the afternoon we fit the extras. And I guess by three o'clock it was we were shooting and it was it was one of those times where you just do and you trust that this is going to be exactly what it should be. And, you know, you go in, we go in that in the auditorium and we would we had the freedom to be able to place people where it was a good mix. And I was very happy and we then went to shoot and when I saw the dailies it was the perfect note and of course, Chris knew it and it was perfect for the essence of that scene. I could not imagine the scene any other way now.

Jillian Chilingerian: I went on Monday to the Making of premiere listening to all of you talk I could not imagine being under these changes and as an audience viewer, you would never know. Seeing all the work that you all put in it's just astonishing to me.

Ellen Mirojnick: Thank you very much. The one thing that I did learn very early on, and it's never escaped me is that you have to think on your feet. It's almost as when you design a film, it's two lifetimes and you have to commit and think on your feet because if you can't hold the camera, it's not allowed. You must solve the problem, so you just have to do it.

Jillian Chilingerian: One last question. I want to ask about the turquoise belt that he wears with the pants that little detail tells us more about him, outside of what we've seen in the film.

Ellen Mirojnick: As a young child, he went to a boys' school in New Mexico and so on, and fell in love with land. In doing the research and looking at all of the images that were available to find, discover, and research he always had this belt on that I did not see clearly. I saw a silver glimmer and it reminded me of a belt that you would actually wear in New Mexico. It was indigenous. In building Los Alamos, and what his suits and shirts look like, it was very much a testament to the land. It was the color palette, the feel of the fabric, the working of the fabric, there was a quality, and although he didn't wear work shirts, he wore a deep blue, which was very close to a work shirt kind of feel as we wanted to go at that time. The silver buckle on the belt had to be included, so we searched high and low for what that belt actually looked like. We assumed that it had to have turquoise in it because that was so much of the time and the place and his love of the land. He used to strike a match to light his pipe with it, it had kind of an indigenous and cowboy-type feel. We wanted to basically create this man who would become totally into his power with details that were totally real to the environment and that included the belt. We finally did see an image although it was faint, but we saw it and we had it done. We had it made so you could find it, so we had it made exactly as he was and it just was perfect as was the hat which was his crown and created the landscape of this mythic man. Both the hat and the belt were so very much attuned to Los Alamos, the love of his land and of his life where he was one with the environment and we were very, very happy. It was one of the things we attacked immediately because it was so much an identifying mark and that's how it happened.

You can read our review of Oppenheimer, here.

You can read our interview with Production Designer Ruth De Jong, here

You can read our interview with Makeup Department Head Luisa Abel, here